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Can someone truly build a working time machine?


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Janus:

 

First, there is never any need to register on a board that is managed the way this one is. Being a "member" actually means nothing unless TTI chooses to install the board's password option. If it chooses to do this, I may or may not continue. Like my father before me who used to be a regular poster here, he also never registered. But he turned me onto this board and I have chosen to participate. He's a Systems Professional and true renaissance thinker. I am but a humble, barely graduated, lab worker in the field of aerospace research. I work a menial job in a shop that builds guidance systems for experimental aircraft. My father is a Ph.D, MS in Computer science and BS in Astronomy. I am but a lowly graduate student of Fluid Dynamics Engineering. I don't claim to be a geek, an egghead, or even smart for that matter. But don't try to snow me. I can spot a phoney from a mile off.

 

I figure a person's words are their bond and the words one uses are signature enough for valid ideas.

 

If someone chooses to "imitate" me here, I will first point out that this is occurring and then switch to a new handle. I prefer to let the readers here be the judges of what is real and what is "bull crap".

 

But... YOU suggested the "new thread", therefore I suggest YOU start it. I would think you know what my Ideas are by now, at least enough that I don't have to re-state them redundantly, and bore everyone here by doing so.

 

Pamela:

 

Actually, I think Janus has done a pretty fair job so far in the "two body problem" discussion. I don't see that he has it quite right just yet, (which is beside the point), but he is putting up a reasonable argument as to what he THINKS it is.

 

I respect that.

 

 

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Valkerie, Read "your comments" here, and give me an answer, as to what the Hell is wrong with this picture?

 

Valkerie Said.......

 

* "I prefer to let the readers here be the judges of what is real and what is "bull crap".

 

* "Time02112:

 

Sorry, but I'm afraid you happen to be one of the "cranks" I was referring to earlier. You offer "doublespeak", mumbo-jumbo, and no REAL explanation of ANYTHING."

 

* "I wasn't going to name names in the "crank" department, but your previous post forces me too.

 

* "Frankly, you don't have the faintest idea what you are talking about and you know it."

 

* "You just want us to think you do. Sorry, there are some people on this board who actually DO know what they are talking about-

 

---You just don't happen to be one of them."

 

* "P.S. Your continued useage of that smug little saying you always sign off with speaks volumes about your over-inflated self image."

 

My response.........

 

Valkerie, you bring new meaning to the word "Paradox" for you, yourself are full of your own "Doublespeak! (Listen to yourself!)

 

I really hope that you, or anyone likewise, never gets the vote to represent the state of the Time~Travel research community, otherwise we all might as well give up now!

 

---------------<W H Y ?>--------------------

 

Because we would certainly fail, before we ever get started.

 

In the words of your dear friend "Janus" I say unto you likewise;--------

 

"I will no longer be reading or responding to any posts you make on any topic. So go hurl insults and preach your beliefs to someone else; I won't be listening."

 

Since both of you appear to be "Birds of a feather, why don't you take your "parroting misconceptions." elswhere; a place in which they are more likely to be accepted by others that think like you.

 

I refuse to appologize for who I am, and just because I cannot, or refuse to exist within the restrictive confines of your your neat little box, does not give you any right to impose, or pass judgement upon me!...you have know idea who I am, moreover, if that makes you uncomfortable, or socially unacceptable, by your standards, then you know what you can do with your little box!

 

I don't need to be patronized, mocked, or insulted by you, or anyone else on my own free time.

 

p)'i4q4

 

 

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Valkerie, Read "your comments" here, and give me an answer, as to what the Hell is wrong with this picture?

 

Valkerie Said.......

 

* "I prefer to let the readers here be the judges of what is real and what is "bull crap".

 

* "Time02112:

 

Sorry, but I'm afraid you happen to be one of the "cranks" I was referring to earlier. You offer "doublespeak", mumbo-jumbo, and no REAL explanation of ANYTHING."

 

* "I wasn't going to name names in the "crank" department, but your previous post forces me too.

 

* "Frankly, you don't have the faintest idea what you are talking about and you know it."

 

* "You just want us to think you do. Sorry, there are some people on this board who actually DO know what they are talking about-

 

---You just don't happen to be one of them."

 

* "P.S. Your continued useage of that smug little saying you always sign off with speaks volumes about your over-inflated self image."

 

My response.........

 

Valkerie, you bring new meaning to the word "Paradox" for you, yourself are full of your own "Doublespeak! (Listen to yourself!)

 

I really hope that you, or anyone likewise, never gets the vote to represent the state of the Time~Travel research community, otherwise we all might as well give up now!

 

---------------<W H Y ?>--------------------

 

Because we would certainly fail, before we ever get started.

 

In the words of your dear friend "Janus" I say unto you likewise;--------

 

"I will no longer be reading or responding to any posts you make on any topic. So go hurl insults and preach your beliefs to someone else; I won't be listening."

 

Since both of you appear to be "Birds of a feather, why don't you take your "parroting misconceptions." elswhere; a place in which they are more likely to be accepted by others that think like you.

 

I refuse to appologize for who I am, and just because I cannot, or refuse to exist within the restrictive confines of your your neat little box, does not give you any right to impose, or pass judgement upon me!...you have know idea who I am, moreover, if that makes you uncomfortable, or socially unacceptable, by your standards, then you know what you can do with your little box!

 

I don't need to be patronized, mocked, or insulted by you, or anyone else on my own free time.

 

p)'i4q4

 

 

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Time02112:

 

Fine. I accept your statement. (Whether I agree with it or not.) Now all you have to do is publish some references here to back up the claims you make. Or at least the details of the reasoning you used to arrive at them. So far you have done neither. You make claims that certain things are "so", and never explain WHY you think so, or offer scientific reference to the foundations of your statements. In short, you make the incorrect presumption that we are bound to believe what you say is true merely because you say so. Sorry, no dice. References please!

 

Time^Master:

 

It's not a position I intend to continue forward with, but one takes a job when one is offered. Hopefully, it will enhance my resume for the future. To specifically answer your question, Aircraft Guidance Systems involve the operation of control surfaces which are in turn operated by hydraulics in many cases. For now, this area is giving me much needed experience in the workplace and while it is not what I would specifically like to apply my teachings to, it is a good start in the real world. And it pays better than slinging hamburgers at Mickey D's.

 

TimeTravelActivist:

 

I fail to see what I have been guilty of other than responding to a personal attack instigated by someone else.

 

It isn't the issue of whether I agree or disagree with a person's point of view, it's the manner in which it is presented. I have found Janus's arguments to be polite, and in the spirit of well conducted debate. Even if I don't agree that he has described the "two body problem" correctly as would apply to my original scenario. DaveTrott is ALSO a speaker of considerable refinement, manners and reasonable presentation. I hope he sticks around.

 

P.S. I'm FEMALE. When you say to Janus, "he's" a buffoon like you, you've made a hugely incorrect presumption of the very type one needs to avoid when engaging in scientific debate. Look up the term "Valkyrie" on one of the web's search engines. You find it under Nordic Mythology as a female witch who accompanies warriors she chooses to be slain, to Valhalla, the Nordic version of "heaven". The archaic Nordic original spelling is with a "y" as opposed to "Valk-e-rie". I choose the "e" for individual personal reasons. As well as the handle. And you can read anything into that you want to. i.e - "Presume" some more.

 

Then to all:

 

If the problem of time travel is to be solved, it can't be by negating proven facts of science. Many people make claims that are just plain wrong and PROVABLE as such. But it does not deter them anyway. As if we can just ignore what we already know.

 

If there is NEW science to be explored, then THAT has to be backed up with sound reasoning and some clear definitions of how one has arrived at the conclusions. THEN the debate can continue on solid ground. If someone has new ideas to propose, they fall apart if further questioning results in the proposer ducking the questions in favor of shifting focus away from that which they already know cannot be explained in their proposal. In other words, a simple "I don't know" will do. But sidestepping questions on the issue destroys the integrity of the original argument. Totally. It's called a "straw man argument" and is a classic technique of debaters who wish to make claims they can't back up or provide data for that stands up to scrutiny.

 

Incredible claims require incredible proof.

 

 

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Time02112:

 

Fine. I accept your statement. (Whether I agree with it or not.) Now all you have to do is publish some references here to back up the claims you make. Or at least the details of the reasoning you used to arrive at them. So far you have done neither. You make claims that certain things are "so", and never explain WHY you think so, or offer scientific reference to the foundations of your statements. In short, you make the incorrect presumption that we are bound to believe what you say is true merely because you say so. Sorry, no dice. References please!

 

Time^Master:

 

It's not a position I intend to continue forward with, but one takes a job when one is offered. Hopefully, it will enhance my resume for the future. To specifically answer your question, Aircraft Guidance Systems involve the operation of control surfaces which are in turn operated by hydraulics in many cases. For now, this area is giving me much needed experience in the workplace and while it is not what I would specifically like to apply my teachings to, it is a good start in the real world. And it pays better than slinging hamburgers at Mickey D's.

 

TimeTravelActivist:

 

I fail to see what I have been guilty of other than responding to a personal attack instigated by someone else.

 

It isn't the issue of whether I agree or disagree with a person's point of view, it's the manner in which it is presented. I have found Janus's arguments to be polite, and in the spirit of well conducted debate. Even if I don't agree that he has described the "two body problem" correctly as would apply to my original scenario. DaveTrott is ALSO a speaker of considerable refinement, manners and reasonable presentation. I hope he sticks around.

 

P.S. I'm FEMALE. When you say to Janus, "he's" a buffoon like you, you've made a hugely incorrect presumption of the very type one needs to avoid when engaging in scientific debate. Look up the term "Valkyrie" on one of the web's search engines. You find it under Nordic Mythology as a female witch who accompanies warriors she chooses to be slain, to Valhalla, the Nordic version of "heaven". The archaic Nordic original spelling is with a "y" as opposed to "Valk-e-rie". I choose the "e" for individual personal reasons. As well as the handle. And you can read anything into that you want to. i.e - "Presume" some more.

 

Then to all:

 

If the problem of time travel is to be solved, it can't be by negating proven facts of science. Many people make claims that are just plain wrong and PROVABLE as such. But it does not deter them anyway. As if we can just ignore what we already know.

 

If there is NEW science to be explored, then THAT has to be backed up with sound reasoning and some clear definitions of how one has arrived at the conclusions. THEN the debate can continue on solid ground. If someone has new ideas to propose, they fall apart if further questioning results in the proposer ducking the questions in favor of shifting focus away from that which they already know cannot be explained in their proposal. In other words, a simple "I don't know" will do. But sidestepping questions on the issue destroys the integrity of the original argument. Totally. It's called a "straw man argument" and is a classic technique of debaters who wish to make claims they can't back up or provide data for that stands up to scrutiny.

 

Incredible claims require incredible proof.

 

 

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Valkerie,

 

While reading your long (boring) 1 page and 1/2 explanation of your self. I found that it reminded me of sitting in one of my lame logic classes in college. Man, you used all of the keywords I learned on my first day there.

 

It took all of that logical ice picking just to prove your case of what we said about you.

 

Just like Janus... Arrogant, and hide behind your words, tisk-tisk. Cover up your mistakes as best you can with logic =P huh? Cleaver, but you don't fool me.

 

I may not be scientific or logical at all times, but I am psychic and empathic =). And I'm hardly ever wrong about people.

 

So just know I didn't buy into your explanation. You contradicted your self and you know it =) admit it.

 

Javier C.

 

P.S. Not another chick =)... J/k

 

 

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Valkerie,

 

While reading your long (boring) 1 page and 1/2 explanation of your self. I found that it reminded me of sitting in one of my lame logic classes in college. Man, you used all of the keywords I learned on my first day there.

 

It took all of that logical ice picking just to prove your case of what we said about you.

 

Just like Janus... Arrogant, and hide behind your words, tisk-tisk. Cover up your mistakes as best you can with logic =P huh? Cleaver, but you don't fool me.

 

I may not be scientific or logical at all times, but I am psychic and empathic =). And I'm hardly ever wrong about people.

 

So just know I didn't buy into your explanation. You contradicted your self and you know it =) admit it.

 

Javier C.

 

P.S. Not another chick =)... J/k

 

 

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"EAT CROW" Valkerie!...you earned it.

 

I do not have to prove a thing to you!

 

Nonetheless, for those of you who are interested in crulling through all of the pages to find somewhat detailed information in reference to many of those ideas I have posted, you can begin with this link:]

 

http://einstein.stanford.edu

 

<This message has been edited by Time02112 (edited 17 June 2000).>

 

 

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"EAT CROW" Valkerie!...you earned it.

 

I do not have to prove a thing to you!

 

Nonetheless, for those of you who are interested in crulling through all of the pages to find somewhat detailed information in reference to many of those ideas I have posted, you can begin with this link:]

 

http://einstein.stanford.edu

 

<This message has been edited by Time02112 (edited 17 June 2000).>

 

 

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TimeTravelActivist:

 

"...Man, you used all of the keywords..."

 

Man? MAN?

 

What sort of outdated long passe street lingo do you call this?

 

"MAN"?????

 

You really do NOT know how to pay attention do you.

 

Oh, and by the way,

 

Go BACK to the HOME PAGE of this board (you know, the one with the code that has the "mouseover" for red banners) and go all the way to the bottom and read the statement where TTI REMINDS YOU that this board is "FICTION"!

 

Thats right "FICTION" spelled "F", "I", "C", "T", "I", "O", "N"!

 

Then go into your bathroom, look into the mirror, pop those disgusting little zits on your juvenile face, and come on back and try to play in an arena where you don't even understand the meaning of the word "vituperative". (Yeah, that's the ticket, go look it up!)

 

Thank you for your continued demonstration of how a typically overly testerone charged sissy can think he can prove his as yet undeveloped manhood by reverting to the literary style of a pre-pubescent junior high school drop out.

 

Damn, you're clever. And it really shows.

 

 

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TimeTravelActivist:

 

"...Man, you used all of the keywords..."

 

Man? MAN?

 

What sort of outdated long passe street lingo do you call this?

 

"MAN"?????

 

You really do NOT know how to pay attention do you.

 

Oh, and by the way,

 

Go BACK to the HOME PAGE of this board (you know, the one with the code that has the "mouseover" for red banners) and go all the way to the bottom and read the statement where TTI REMINDS YOU that this board is "FICTION"!

 

Thats right "FICTION" spelled "F", "I", "C", "T", "I", "O", "N"!

 

Then go into your bathroom, look into the mirror, pop those disgusting little zits on your juvenile face, and come on back and try to play in an arena where you don't even understand the meaning of the word "vituperative". (Yeah, that's the ticket, go look it up!)

 

Thank you for your continued demonstration of how a typically overly testerone charged sissy can think he can prove his as yet undeveloped manhood by reverting to the literary style of a pre-pubescent junior high school drop out.

 

Damn, you're clever. And it really shows.

 

 

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Valkerie: :-)

 

See why I stopped paying attention to them? It'll never work, they'll never give in, no matter how infantile and insulting they have to become before you just give up.

 

I like how Time02112 responds to your post right after he says he won't even read your posts...

 

Oh, and for the record, yes I did cheat and read TTA & Time02112's posts, but at least I didn't respond to them.

 

 

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Valkerie: :-)

 

See why I stopped paying attention to them? It'll never work, they'll never give in, no matter how infantile and insulting they have to become before you just give up.

 

I like how Time02112 responds to your post right after he says he won't even read your posts...

 

Oh, and for the record, yes I did cheat and read TTA & Time02112's posts, but at least I didn't respond to them.

 

 

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Valkerie and Janus,

 

You both claim to have all the right answers? Yet you participate in a message board where obviously your intelligence is constently being insulted... The true question would be, why? Why do you post if you don't like what your reading? You remind me of the bully at school that would always mess around with the little kids because he's really a sad person in side. Are you that sad inside Valkerie? And how about you Janus, what's troubling you in your life, are you not happy with your wife (or have one)? Your responses to people all come into some form of attack... Why?

 

Who are you really attacking? What do you hate about your selves? How are your relationships with your mother and father? I would really look into that as being your problem, not my posting.

 

Oh and by the way, I'm not a sissy, I'm far from that =). And I don't get any complaints about my manhood either =D haha if you know what I mean.

 

Valkerie, don't be upset that you never gotten it good in your life =) I can tell you're a bitter woman. Why not participate in a feminist message board and burn your bras, or whatever you men hating women do =D. Seems more down your alley.

 

If you can't stand the heat, do the smart thing like your little buddy Janus did, and in the words of The Great One, The Rock; 'Know your damn role, and shut your mouth Jabronie.' Look that one up =).

 

-Javier C.

 

(No offence to the women reading this, my response was just to Valkerie).

 

 

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Valkerie and Janus,

 

You both claim to have all the right answers? Yet you participate in a message board where obviously your intelligence is constently being insulted... The true question would be, why? Why do you post if you don't like what your reading? You remind me of the bully at school that would always mess around with the little kids because he's really a sad person in side. Are you that sad inside Valkerie? And how about you Janus, what's troubling you in your life, are you not happy with your wife (or have one)? Your responses to people all come into some form of attack... Why?

 

Who are you really attacking? What do you hate about your selves? How are your relationships with your mother and father? I would really look into that as being your problem, not my posting.

 

Oh and by the way, I'm not a sissy, I'm far from that =). And I don't get any complaints about my manhood either =D haha if you know what I mean.

 

Valkerie, don't be upset that you never gotten it good in your life =) I can tell you're a bitter woman. Why not participate in a feminist message board and burn your bras, or whatever you men hating women do =D. Seems more down your alley.

 

If you can't stand the heat, do the smart thing like your little buddy Janus did, and in the words of The Great One, The Rock; 'Know your damn role, and shut your mouth Jabronie.' Look that one up =).

 

-Javier C.

 

(No offence to the women reading this, my response was just to Valkerie).

 

 

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I would advise that everyone simply ignore flames such as these, as they contribute nothing to the discussion of time travel and often destroy the original discussion in a thread.

 

So I ask everyone on this board to refrain from replying to blatant flames, even if they are directed at you. I realize it may be tempting to respond (God knows I am) but it serves no useful purpose.

 

 

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I would advise that everyone simply ignore flames such as these, as they contribute nothing to the discussion of time travel and often destroy the original discussion in a thread.

 

So I ask everyone on this board to refrain from replying to blatant flames, even if they are directed at you. I realize it may be tempting to respond (God knows I am) but it serves no useful purpose.

 

 

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